What book are you reading tonight?


(Stanton) #421

Frank Miller was also great, but he isn’t any more.
He made his best work back in the 80s with Ronin and Elektra: Assassin. Both are superior to The Dark Knight Returns, which was also a very important work. He made more good to great books with Batman: Year One, Give Me Liberty, Hard Boiled, 300 and most (but not all) of the Sin City stuff.
But his recent comics are often disappointing.


(tomas) #422

yeah, i agree, he is not great nowadays, plus his efforts as a director are dubious
i would add to those mentioned comicbooks also Big Guy and The Rusty the Boy Robot - maybe libretto is not Miller´s best, but at least art by Geoff darrow is stunning


(Stanton) #423

This Big Guy thing was very boring. I have no clue why he actually did it. Must have been some sort of homage to whatever.


(Bill san Antonio) #424

Isn’t Miller kinda soft in the head nowadays?


(Stanton) #425

Ha ha, yes, I have read some things about him which make this conclusion probable.


(tomas) #426

soft in the head was also his story/script for Robocop 3, but who knows what exactly happened there
Robocop 2 was quite okay though

actually i quite liked Big Guy, but probably not for Miller´s credit, but Darrow´s , his godzilla monster was great


(TheBigSmokedown) #427

Right, Frank Miller has written some great stories. He’s also the most accomplished combination writer/artist I can think of, but he’s incapable of matching Moore in the quality of his writing.

Ugh. I already mentioned Gaiman, but maybe I should elaborate. His plotting is pretty loose and comics like Sandman sort of meander along. This leads me to conclude that Gaiman is just not very good at writing clever stories and I can’t help feeling he tries too hard too hard to be poetic. It is, in my opinion, pretentious.

An artist foremost and not a dazzling writer from what little I’ve seen.

A good writer and a good artist, but his writing is not top notch.

Okay, Morrison, when he’s on form, is pretty damn good. I could maybe give you Morrison, but his writing is extremely patchy in quality.

Sigh. Both good, but not great.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that Moore’s writing genuinely transcends the medium. I’d recommend a lot of writers to other fans of comics, but Moore’s best work I’d actually recommend to fans of literature in general. He deserves to be recognised as one of our greatest living writers.

The thing is, I completely agree that for example Frank Miller has been responsible for some great comics. Sin City is a fantastic hard-boiled read with good dialogue and a neat plot. It’s a little work of art, because Miller created a visual style synonymous with the book, blending art and writing to create a perfect package. It’s really a masterwork. However, I wouldn’t put him on the same level as Moore because I don’t think Miller is capable of the kind of deep thinking which sometimes finds its way into Moore’s work. Moore is unusual because, yes, he is capable of good story and dialogue, but he also brings a rich understanding of literature to his writing. Consequently he writes convincingly about policical and philosophical ideas. It’s challenging in a way which most comic book writing is not – even other good comic book writing.


(tomas) #428

[quote=“TheBigSmokedown, post:427, topic:1204”]Right, Frank Miller has written some great stories. He’s also the most accomplished combination writer/artist I can think of, but he’s incapable of matching Moore in the quality of his writing.

Ugh. I already mentioned Gaiman, but maybe I should elaborate. His plotting is pretty loose and comics like Sandman sort of meander along. This leads me to conclude that Gaiman is just not very good at writing clever stories and I can’t help feeling he tries too hard too hard to be poetic. It is, in my opinion, pretentious.

An artist foremost and not a dazzling writer from what little I’ve seen.

A good writer and a good artist, but his writing is not top notch.

Okay, Morrison, when he’s on form, is pretty damn good. I could maybe give you Morrison, but his writing is extremely patchy in quality.

Sigh. Both good, but not great.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that Moore’s writing genuinely transcends the medium. I’d recommend a lot of writers to other fans of comics, but Moore’s best work I’d actually recommend to fans of literature in general. He deserves to be recognised as one of our greatest living writers.

The thing is, I completely agree that for example Frank Miller has been responsible for some great comics. Sin City is a fantastic hard-boiled read with good dialogue and a neat plot. It’s a little work of art, because Miller created a visual style synonymous with the book, blending art and writing to create a perfect package. It’s really a masterwork. However, I wouldn’t put him on the same level as Moore because I don’t think Miller is capable of the kind of deep thinking which sometimes finds its way into Moore’s work. Moore is unusual because, yes, he is capable of good story and dialogue, but he also brings a rich understanding of literature to his writing. Consequently he writes convincingly about policical and philosophical ideas. It’s challenging in a way which most comic book writing is not – even other good comic book writing.[/quote]

but i wrote in my post that they are not of that importance as Moore is
i just picked up few artists, i could add Ennis, Ellis, Jodorowsky and many more … - many authors helped to create more versatile face of comics medium (but again, the size of an impact of their works on this medium differs)

actually Azzarello, Morrison and Gaiman (and i add also manga Blame! by Tsutomu Nihei and Dorohedoro by Q-Hayashida) are my more favorites authors than Moore - i like Lovelles, 100 bullets, Sandman, Blame!, Azzarello´s Hellblazer works a little more than Moore´s stuff


(TheBigSmokedown) #429

Importance I guess does factor into it, but I’m talking about the intelligence behind their writing.

[quote=“tomas, post:428, topic:1204”]i just picked up few artists, i could add Ennis, Ellis, Jodorowsky and many more … - many authors helped to create more versatile face of comics medium (but again, the size of an impact of their works on this medium differs)

actually Azzarello, Morrison and Gaiman (and i add also manga Blame! by Tsutomu Nihei and Dorohedoro by Q-Hayashida) are my more favorites authors than Moore - i like Lovelles, 100 bullets, Sandman, Blame!, Azzarello´s Hellblazer works a little more than Moore´s stuff[/quote]

I like Ellis. He is a talented writer, but he reverts to being juvenile too often.

Anyway, there are lots of good writers. You didn’t mention Mark Millar, but he’s a very gifted storyteller and his books have a lot of impact. In fact, I have enjoyed reading some of his books more than some of Moore’s. My point, though, is that these good writers do not match Moore in terms of writing meaningful literature (for want of a better term).


(Stanton) #430

Miller’s Ronin and Elektra: Assassin can compete with Moore’s best works, his other stuff not.

A brilliant writer is David Lapham. Stray Bullets is excellent, only that he hasn’t finished it, and probably will never do, cause he can’t sell enough of the issues.

Other overwhelming US comics are Black Hole by Charles Burns and Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron by Daniel Clowes. And many of the Love and Rockets comics by the Hernandez Bros.


(tomas) #431

well, i wasn´t talking about intelligence primarily - but if i do, Moore is surely one of most intelligent authors
i was more focused on that importance impact (but i also tried to name intelligent authors :slight_smile:
for example i mentioned McKeever, which could seem odd - one can ask, how important could be his comicbooks for the growth of the medium, but i think that his weird stories like Faith, Extremist, Meta4 made a difference in understanding of what comicbooks could be

i recently have read Orbiter and Ocean and i must admit it could be a lot better …

haven´t read that much from Millar
to name some others, Brian Michael Bendis, Brian K. Vaughan, and Mike Carey, they are not that favorite of mine, but some of their librettos are interesting
oh yes, and Peter Milligan is one hell of writer


(Phil H) #432

As I’ve mentioned before I’m on this project I’ve set for myself at the moment where I watch films, listen to music and read books from a different year each week. My target for reading is one novel each week and so far I’ve read:

1960 - To Kill a Mocking Bird (Harper Lee)
1961 - Catch-22 (Joseph Hellerman)
- Actually I couldn’t finish this one in time but had read it before and couldn’t resist including it.
1962 - A Clockwork Orange (Anthony Burgess)
1963 - The Spy Who Came in from the Cold (John Le Carre)
1964 - Last Exit to Brooklyn (Hubert Selby Jr.)
1965 - The Man With the Golden Gun (Ian Fleming)
1966 - Alfie (Bill Naughton)

This week is 1967 and am currently reading The Mimic Men by V.S. Naipaul and have Gore Vidal’s Myra Breckinridge lined up for 1968 next week.

I’m really enjoying this part of the project actually although am finding it hard to find something for every week which suitably reflects the year it was published and which is a manageable length to complete inside a week. Catch-22 being a good example of a book that was just to big to finish in time. I just read as much of it as I could in the time I had. So far all have been enjoyable in one way or another but some have been better than others. Mocking Bird was a real joy, Brooklyn was less so, Golden Gun was probably the weakest Bond book I have read (it was his last), Clockwork Orange a feat of linguistic genius, Alfie was superbly written and Le Carre’s Spy was just a thumping good read.


(davidf) #433

The Enclyclopedia of Animated Cartoons" 1911- 1998.


(Bill san Antonio) #434

I finished Herzog on Herzog recently. This interview book was already published some 10 years ago and it took me time to get my hands on it. It’s mostly good, interesting book, all Herzog film at date are covered. I had of course seen/heard many interviews and commentary tracks from dvd’s so there wasn’t as much new information for me but for I’d recommend it to those who aren’t so familiar with the background of Herzog’s works. Some chapters I found disappointing, for example the chapter about Kinski is just re-telling of the same stories told in My Best Fiend.


(tomas) #435

Ringworld (1970) by Larry Niven
Niven is a classic representative of hard science fiction
Ringworld is his first entry in the Ringworld series, which won a Hugo and Nebula Award for Best SF Novel back in 70’s
In few days one my friend will bring me fourth book of the series Ringworld’s Children, so i’m going to re-read three ringworld novels i have.
I would add that Niven for more than forty years developed his fictional universe called Known Space, where many of his books take place, including ringworld series.
It is my second favorite sci-fi novel, right after the Brian W. Aldiss novel Nonstop (highly recommended as well)
btw, ringworld artificial megastructure belongs to one of most fascinating space structures in sf literature
(Dyson’s sphere and Clarke’ Rama would be others)

awesome cover for Ringworld’s Children


(tomas) #436

started re-reading Stephen Hawking’s The Universe In The Nutshell (reasonable choice after Kaku’s Hyperspace)


(tomas) #437

i’m reading Jumper by Steven Gould
it has reputation that it is book for young adult and this could be little misleading -
although main hero is a teenager, it is a normal book with plenty of nasty scenes, good characterization, and intriguing story
i think, if hero wasn’t a teenager, but let’s say, forty years old guy, the novel would be considered as an adult material
the movie Jumper with Hayden Christensen is based on this book,
but as i know from some reviews and text i have read so far, the book is much better (the film is based only loosely on the book) -
so if you’ve seen the movie, and didn’t like it, it is great possibility that you would like the book
i would compare it to the movie Constantine, which is based on comics Hellblazer - two different worlds, i’d say, and that of comics’ much better
btw, Jumper is sf novel about teleportation


(davidf) #438

The Superhero Book


(I...I...Idiot) #439

A nice collection of tales from Richard Matheson, know for his Twilight Zone episodes, I Am Legend, Hell House & others.


(John Welles) #440

At the moment, I am split between reading two books: Marvel Masterworks: Sgt Fury and his Howling Commandos Vol.4 and Henri Charrière’s follow-up to Papilllon, Banco. Both are really fun reads, although with the former you can’t it too seriously and with the latter, you must unfortunately question how much of it is true.