Winnetou 3. Teil was shot from June 8 to August 13, 1965, Old Surehand 1. Teil from August 23 to October 27, 1965 (Petzel, Karl-May-Filmbuch, see above).
Read your edit just now.
Winnetou 3. Teil was shot from June 8 to August 13, 1965, Old Surehand 1. Teil from August 23 to October 27, 1965 (Petzel, Karl-May-Filmbuch , see above).
And The Oil Prince was shot March 28 to May 31.
Blam blam blam. That’s 3 movies made virtually back to back. Each of them also only 2-3 months for release after production finished. Oil Prince in August, Winnetou 3 in October and Ild Surehand in December. Rialto never messed around - that’s cos they were backed by Constantiin who could get them distributed immediately.
Does anyone know more about international releases of some of these? With Eureka’s release of the CCC Karl May films (vs. the Rialto ones) most likely not containing English dubs, I wonder which of these were ever released in English speaking markets at all? According to the IMDb, Old Shatterhand had a USA theatrical release. Is that for real?
Hi - i have seen the whole 11 Winnetou series and i believe they all have English dubs although i watched a few in German with English subtitles. The 9 Rialto films are available on German Blu Ray from Tobis/Universum and i think these all have English dubs - the Blu Rays not the DVDs. Thunder at the Border was released by Sony in the USA also.
There is a Winnetou I-III Blu Ray set all with English dubs
Old Surehand 3 movie Blu Ray set with English dubs (only 2 of these have Stewart Granger’s own voice)
German versions also have the wire-trip horsefalls intact - 3/4 of the movies have these - which will be cut for any UK release.
I’d caution that both Treasure of Silver Lake and Winnetou I (Winnetou the Warrior) have incomplete English dubs as the English language version was an abridged print (they removed a lot of the unfunny comedy relief). IIRC the Blu Ray just switched to German in those scenes but it’s pretty easy to work out what they are saying.
Of the 2 CCC films Old Shatterhand was released theatrically in the UK as well as Apaches Last Battle and you can find bootlegs of this. I would have thought Eureka will have the English version of this. The last film, Winnetou amd Shatterhand in the Valley of Death is the only debatable one as I’ve not come across an English dub - and it was the only Winnetou movie not released theatrically in the UK - but I would expect Eureka to have found one.
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That’s very helpful, thanks.
Winnetou and the Half Breed Apache also not released in the UK but does have English dub.
Just to reiterate- German Blu Rays not DVDs as a couple of the Tobis/Universum DVDs (Winnetou 1 and Thunder at the Border) are missing English dubs but these were added for the Blu Rays.
There’s about 10m approx not in English for Treasure of Silver Lake and Winnetou 1 so if you have an English print of this it will run short.
In Treasure of Silver Lake the footage cut from the English version is almost all of Eddi Arent’s initial scenes until it gets to the point where they can’t cut him for plot continuity reasons. Arent was a comedian who had comedy roles in most of Rialto Edgar Wallace movies. Outside of Germany he is virtually unknown and probably very irritating. Amusingly, in the German version Arent’s silly character is an English lord but in the English dubbed version he is an Austrian Duke.
In Winnetou I - virtually all scenes involving another comedy character Jefferson Tuff-Tuff, played by Chris Howland a British DJ resident in Germany, were cut of the English print. Howland makes Arent look like Charlie Chaplin. Also cut were some comic asides from the Sam Hawkens character and brief scenes of him being romantically chased by a Sioux woman. Howland also turns up in a small role in the Steffen/Garko western Blood at Sundown (which had German co-financing) as a comedy storekeeper.
Thunder at the Border, with Rod Cameron, has an equally bad comic character played by Victor de Kowa who unfortunately isn’t edited out at all.
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Karl May = Kara Ben Nemsi= Karl Sohn der Deutschen (Karl, son of the Germans). That was the explanation Kal May used. Kara was just used phonetically.
Eureka Box has English dub on Winnetou and Shatterhand in the Valley of Death, as well as on Old Shatterhand and on The Shoot.
Kara Ben Nemsi
The derivation of the name has presented specialists with quite a few riddles. Kara has been interpreted as a simple corruption of the name Karl, but in that case it’s still interesting to find out how Karl became Kara. Did Karl May simply invent the name of did he hear someone use it on one of his journeys? A person in Turkey or the Middle East might have addressed him as Kara, or something similar, after all Karl must have sounded alien to their ears and they might have corrupted the name. Kara means black or dark in Turkish and would then refer to the character’s dark beard. However, there is a third possibility: the name could be derived from the Arabic verb qaara’a ( قرأ ) = to read, to recite; the meaning of the name would then be something like ‘he who can read’, or, as we would say, ‘a literate man’. In a region where most people were analphabetic or semi-alphabetic in those days, his capacities must have looked quite impressive to the locals. It’s not unlikely that he was called a literate man or as someone who could read, and he might have interpreted this as his name. Ben is Arabic and means ‘son of’, so there’s no problem with this part of the character’s name. But ‘Nemsi’? Nemsi has been traced back to the Russian word for German Немецкий, nemetsjki, which in Ottoman Turkish would have become Nemsji (modern Turkish Nemse), but its meaning is ‘Austrian’ rather than German; However, it is possible that someone mistook May for an Austrian (or a Habsburger) and that May mistakenly interpreted the term as the local word for German.
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Im not really deep in Karls biography, but I guess, he invented the name. He visited the countries he wrote about in his novels as an old man the first time, if I remember correctly. So he wrote about foreign countries but never had seen them before his elder years. It was pure imagination. Everything he knows about other countries was taken off from other books he read. Don’t forget, he was a notorious liar and a minor criminal. Germany and Austria were departed in 1806 before that, many German-Roman Emperors were Habsburger. And until 1871 there was no real emotional splitting between Germans and Austrians. There was the hope to grow together again. So I guess, the word Nemsi was used for both nations. ( the same with the word “Dutch”, until 1648 , before the Netherlands officially departed from the Holy-Roman-Empire, the British people called all the Germans Dutch too, in these days German was only a language and not a real nationality). What I want to say is: Karl is not really trustworthy, so we will never really find out what the true reasons for the name Kara Ben Nemsi are.
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Kara Milovy was the name of one of the Bond girls.
Maybe both men and women can have this name, like Maria.
Gian Maria Volonte for example.
Sounds reasonable, the term ‘Немецкий, nemetsjki’ originally referred to people who spoke German, or a similar language (for instance Dutch): the meaning is something like ‘speechless’, or ‘without words’, which means that the people from Russia couldn’t understand a word of it. They were able to understand, more or less, people from Poland, Bulgaria, etc. because their languages had a lot of words in common and sounded familiar. But German or Dutch didn’t make any sense to them. But later Nemsji/Nemse and all variation strictly referred to Austria, not Germany. In Arabic al-Nimsa ( النمسا ) is still the word for Austria, Germany is called Almanya in Arabic.
I checked: according to most sources, Karl May only visited the Middle-East in 1899-1900, years after he had written his first adventures of Kara Ben Nemsi. I guess he read books about the region and picked up some words and names that he used in his novels.
Good information about the Russian meaning of “Nemsi” ! Thank you !
My opinion, too. He picked up some words of the books he read and mixed them up without a deeper knowledge of the real meaning. So we got some words or names based of different languages.
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Authors are generally very proud of their knowledge of foreign languages and cultures. Agatha Christie knew a little French, not very much, but liked to show it off and chose a Belgian, French-speaking protagonist, Hercule Poirot, to whom she constantly put French words and terms.
Good to know ! Haven’t read much biographical about Ms. Christie.
In case of Karl, I guess he was some kind of a little but very intelligent imposter. In his younger days he tried to make the people believe that he was really a world-travelling man. Not only in his novels, he talked about his voyages, but had less more seen than the Saxony.
A post was merged into an existing topic: [Blu-ray] Latest and Upcoming Releases 
Thanks - it seems 3 of them do from one of the links and the reviewer mentions the the English dub is not publicised by Eureka.
If anyone spots the C and F words let me know where they are.
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A German movie of the 60s, I could imagine a bad guy saying stuff like “bitch” or “whore” in a suitable context (like an attack, attempted rape, whatever a gang of bandits would be after), but not anything German equivalent to the C word or F word
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these are movies made for the whole family. The words with C or F never included in the originals. We are talking about Karl-May-Flicks, they are real lame and conservative.
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