The Christmas Kid / Joe Navidad (Sidney W. Pink, 1967)

I think now it’s enough.

I also had my (idiotic) quarrel with SD, and he was also responding in a offending way, but you can’t offend me in a forum. Truth is, it’s nearly impossible to offend me in “real life”, because if I’m realising that someone is trying to do so I always had to laugh, because offending people is a primitive, childish behaviour.

Surprisingly the Rev seems not to think about it that way, and it’s a shame that he has left this forum, because of this idiotic gibberish. But as I had said somewhere else: Don’t answer him, it’s only a waste of time.

So it’s not the first time that our friend SD is insulting people for unknown reasons. Obviously he is also not able to understand or to learn, so that I think the fun is over now. Maybe SD should leave this forum because of his unamiable attitude towards other members.

I’m also hoping that the Rev comes back. I always liked his style and his contributions.

Please come back, ignore him, have fun, it’s x-mas!!!

Disruptive behaviour, being rude and offensive to other members and so on is no good for any forum.

Stanton has the right attitude…ignore, and do not rise to the bait as it is not productive and is a waste of time.

GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT BEFORE YOU SPEAK

  1. I have NOT “offended or disrupted” anybody at any time.
    That is a DAMNED LIE and FALSEHOOD and I expect an APOLOGY.
    Quote where I have used abusive/foul/name calling “language” towards anyone.
    You cannot quote it because it DOES NOT exist.

  2. I correctly responded to quote rev danite “I was clumsy and rude” and
    I posted reasons WHY JEFF HUNTER commands due respect/admiration etc etc.

  3. I see from the last 2 posts that I am singled out as being a new member and
    having dared to speak out strongly on my principles and beliefs.
    It is very easy to just go quietly along agreeing and nodding (as many do here)
    but if you feel strongly about SW/Westerns/Actors and see VERY OFFENSIVE
    disparaging/insulting of SW of Directors like Fidani , then many SW fans will not
    just sit there and “be quiet”

  4. I think it is pathetic and cheap for people like Stanton to now regurgitate themselves
    after I have had “arguments/discussions” and “opposing views” with them and seek
    TO STAB ME IN THE BACK. I have defeated numerous false arguments/views on
    this forum with facts/SW knowledge and not sought to ingratiate myself by
    crawling up to anybody.

  5. I will NEVER be intimidated by threats or conspiracies in forums or in real life.
    If I feel something is WRONG/OFFENSIVE/UNTRUE , then I have every right to speak.

  6. NOBODY except Scherp, has shown any sympathy , or intelligence or understanding
    towards me or my 100% correct arguments and discussions on the insults to Hunter.
    What we have had is “listen” we are CHUMMY, we know the rev, we like the rev etc

    THERE ARE 2 SIDES TO EACH STORY OR ARGUMENT AND THE WORD FAIR IS VITAL .

[quote=“scherpschutter, post:16, topic:809”]Come on, SD, the Rev already made his apologies on another thread.
He can be rude from time to time, like I can be rude and you can be rude.
From time. To Time.
But I know you’re not a bad guy, and that he isn’t a bad guy either.
And you said yourself che io sono una brava persona, so I’ll take you’re word for it.

Nobody said Jeffrey Hunter was a bad actor.
He was a fine actor, but he wasn’t a very lucky one. Some of his films weren’t that succesful (at least at the time) and he was forced to accept several parts in minor productions.
I mentioned, for this reason, Find a place to die: whatever you think of the film, it was a modest production, entirely shot in Italy (not even in Almeria), but it was made worthwhile by Jeffrey’s fine performance.

Whatever drinks, depressants or medicines he took, was his business, no doubt about it, but why should we conceal the fact when we talk about him? He was a fine actor and he was an alcoholic - so what? Whether his drinking etc. affected his acting, we cannot say (he did not make the same films he made as an alcoholic as a non-alcoholic, so it’s a logical impossibility to make out if these hypothetic movies would’ve been better than the one’s he made).
But that’s all unimportant:
I’m not an alcoholic and I’m not a fine actor.
Dylan Thomas was an alcoholic and a great poet.
I’m neither.
Wittgenstein was a short-tempered homosexual and an inflexible mister know-it-all.
I’m not (hope so).
But he was the greatest philosopher of the 20th Century.
I’m not (afraid so)

We are what we are,
and so are the stars.

We owe them all due respect, but that’s it: they’re no Saints.
Admiration is enough, we don’t have to worship them.[/quote]

Thanks Scherp I appreciate your quite balanced/fair analysis of the JEFF HUNTER matter.
I had not actually read until after I posted (yesterday) any apology in another thread.

It was most unfortunate that a respected actor and a quality SW that I had just
praised and positively reviewed was chosen as a target for cheap, idiotic unfunny jokes
I have strong principles, having joined the forum as a devoted Euro/SW fan I get upset
when I see SW/actors/directors continually being insulted/mocked/undervalued etc.

I am NOT interested in as they say “ar-s- e licking or crawling up to” forum demeaning
behaviour, hence if I have a statement/fact/opinion/correction to say I WILL SAY it.

I have ARGUED STRONGLY yes on the arguments but have NOT insulted or offended
anyone by attacking/name calling them as such.
I post based on the content and data NOT on who my friends are on the forum, hence
I have now had the “pack” reaction of ganging up against me led by defeated Stanton :’(

Anyway I think you are a good/fair minded /intelligent person. Thank you Scherp.

No need for anybody to leave the forum just because of this, I think you should continue to fight instead :wink:

We already have enough missing members as you know!

It’s usually peaceful around here, but some quarreling won’t affect the rest of this place!

[quote=“SARTANA DJANGO, post:23, topic:809”]1. I have NOT “offended or disrupted” anybody at any time.
That is a DAMNED LIE and FALSEHOOD and I expect an APOLOGY.
Quote where I have used abusive/foul/name calling “language” towards anyone.
You cannot quote it because it DOES NOT exist.[/quote]

Quotes from previous page:

[quote=“SARTANA DJANGO”]6. IMDB has no mention of any “drinking” or beer belly/gut ?? maybe you confuse
JEFFREY HUNTER with your xmas celebrations and your appearance . ??[/quote]

[quote=“SARTANA DJANGO”]We DID NOT need this utterly STUPID defamatory drunken

NON “review”. [/quote]

[quote=“SARTANA DJANGO”]I agree your total lack of any knowledge, any “review” “ability” and failure to properly
discuss/analyse/evaluate

THE CHRISTMAS KID 66

All these DEFECTS with you Jonah Hex can be described as “SU-CKS” I agree[/quote]

Yes Wolf those quotes are part of the HEATED ARGUMENT
whereby I clearly expressed upsetting, revulsion at the slandering, mocking, insulting of
a great actor who died early and tragically (Jeffrey Hunter).

The rev had already said he was “clumsy and rude” and that he may have fallen asleep
through xmas spirits/alcohol so my arguments expanded and followed those facts up.
I was rightly outraged/unhappy as you all should be when you have just given positive
review/admiration for an actor’s work and then a malicious attack is made without any
merit/facts/reason. We all may have problems in private life but Hunter was at work.
Hex is antagonistic to me as we all know, he like Stanton have been exposed/defeated in previous posts and resent my very presence as it reminds them of their defeats etc.
I simply told him that not knowing or discussing a film/actor was a matter that “su-cks”.

I have NOT deliberately insulted or attacked (name called) anybody as I deal in facts only. On any forum there will be contradictions, heated disagreements and word plays
alleging that one forumite is more able than the other etc If a guy is ignorant then he is.

sd ive let your snide remarks go unanswered on previous post because its not my habit to argue with people with infantile mentalities,but im sick of your arrogant diatribes…first off all iv’e ever done is ribb you a little,i dont know about your circle of friends(if you have any) but thats what men do to each other where i come from.sensitive little flowers like you are so low on self esteem that you cant take any view that differs from your own .you proceed to throw a bitch fit worse than lindsay lohan on the rag when your precious opinion is challenged.and thats all these are-opinions. is your life so sad that all you have to worry about is defending some film or actor? ive seen this film and in my opinion it blows! so what? get over it.Im sorry if ive made you loose sleep,or consider suicide i didnt realize my opinion mattered so much to you.

Ok, SD, to make a few things clear.

I have nothing against you! Believe it or not!

I’m of course not interested to stab anything in anyones back, this is something you’ll easily do by yourself. I’m also not interested in intimidating people (why should I?).

I don’t lead anyone, and I think the forum members wouldn’t let themselves be led anywhere.

I have nothing against your “principles” or your “views”, however confused they are. On the contrary I think it’s refreshing to read such things. And mostly funny, in your case.

But I dislike your rude behaviour, your unability to accept someone else’s opinion (and we are talking here mostly about opinions), your unnecessary railing against everyone who has a slightly different opinion, your (mostly wrong) speculating about other member’s tastes or meanings without any evidence.
Can’t you defend your views without attacking other people? You may think you are Mr.“always 100% correct”, but I don’t think so.

And as I already had said, the fun is over when your childish behaviour throws other members out of the forum.

And if you ask me, both you and the Rev can stay in the forum.
But if I had to make a decision between the both of you, I would vote for the Reverend, not only because he had more interesting things to say then you, but also because he knew about the unwritten (are there written ones?) rules of a “social togetherness”.

Thanks for the votes of confidence. There’s a great big wilderness outside this forum, and I appreciate more now what Sebastian and the deputies have achieved in building this up. Its a very good thing indeed and I like being part of it.
I’ve promised my choir-mistress that I’ll try and be nice - and thet’s what I’m gonna do. Try.
There were other mitigating circumstances that stupidly caused me to “lose my faith”, compounded by my upset.
I don’t usually act this way - made of sterner stuff … and I was being cowardly when I pressed that ‘delete’ button.
It is pretty obvious SD that I like the sound of my own voice, and find my own jokes highly amusing - well I for one havn’t heard them before!
But I’ll do my best to keep out of your way … and if you could return that compliment, that’d be fine.
If not, may I suggest that you take your own advice about ‘never read a review that contained spoilers’ or somesuch, and I’ll lable my reviews as such, to warn you. Then, if you chose to read them - you’ve only yourself to blame if, or when, you get upset.
I’ll continue to write as I see fit and maintain, as before … that I’m entitled to my opinions.
In the past you’ve been rude or dismissive about films that I like (The Full Monty); music that I like (heavy rock);
you’ve insulted actors and films with such words as “fat” (yes); (Let he who is without sin …) and please check the ‘Suicidal Actors’ thread for proof of such - altho’ it pains me to go back and fully check some of the nonsense on this thread. You’ve even suggested that I might shag choirboys. Well I took this as the joke it was obviously meant to be … but you’ve gotta realise that if you can make rude asides then so can we all. When I put one of those little emoticons ie :wink: next to my words, it means I’m joking - as when I mentioned ‘Terry Scott’. If you don’t get (or want to get) my jokes - then please, simply choose not to read them. There is such a thing as self-censorship. If you dont like sex on the tele then switch it off - besides they’re too narrow these days and you might fall off! (There, I warned you off my jokes.)
Obviously, SD, you have the right of reply … because you like the sound of your own voice as well. BUT - I will not be responding further. I’ve said it all now.
I would like to thank my friends for supporting my right to express my opinion, and I apologise for being cowardly.
I’m back now, I’ve slimmed down - shedding both pounds(on a couple more films) and posts. I’m fighting fit but I’ll be staying out of trouble … I hope.
Can we get back to the films now please?

Welcome back, and let’s do so!

Yes, let’s do so ! Great to have you back, Reverend !!!

Glad you are back Rev.
I think this is the perfect time for a new start for everyone eh?
Goodwill to all men and all that.

I agree ;D.

Apparently I missed a lot of action during my absence.
I tried to calm things down on Christmas night, but obviously - the Rev leaving the buiding - I wasn’t very succesful.
But unlike Elvis, the Rev didn’t leave us forever, and ever.
That’s a good thing to hear.

I agree with the good wishes welcoming you back Rev. Danite I never wanted you to leave.

I have been accused of NOT always reading what others have posted or"understanding"
it the way I choose to and that I now realise does happen occasionally.
I did NOT see or read your apology on the “happy xmas” thread and was far too severe
and maybe “outrageous”(as Sebastian said)in defending JEFF HUNTER’s honour/name.

I realised you were joking as I was on the previous choir boys etc humour, but it was very unfortunate as I said that the target was a “great” 1960s actor/very fine 60s SW.
If you had picked something like “forrest gump” or “tootsie” I would have laughed also.
I am very devoted/fan-atic towards SW/Euro Westerns/Giallos/Horror/Thrillers/Scifi and
sometimes react strongly or pursue an argument “too intensely” when I perceive that
others are not as appreciative. I realise now as you have pointed out Rev that I too
strongly condemned things like “full monty” and “very loud rock” and some like those :o

Because of vile critics like Loser Halliwell and their continuous putting down of Westerns,
horror,thrillers I have become very combative and determined to set the record straight.
This of course should not be at the expense of upsetting other forum members.

There is no need to keep out of anybody’s way I think we are all much wiser/calmer now

My APOLOGIES to The Forum/ Sebastian/ Rev. Danite if any upset was caused.

PS. Stanton I read your post I am glad you find liking your fellow German No3 SW star
funny and my love of actors/actresses even funnier maybe but its all opinion.
But I realise that these “heated arguments” need to be carefully controlled because
they can stray into areas of “personal” attack or be seen as such. Point taken.
I may be lacking in the “social togetherness” etiquette but hope to pick it up soon :wink:

I think this is a good, x-mas appropiate style to end such a discussion.

Something calm and off topic about Leslie Halliwell.

I think nobody who loves SWs is much interested in the views of LH, who was an apologet of mainstream Hollywood films.
I have (yes I admit) a 1979 edition and a 2003 edition of his film guide, and I was always disappointed by most of his ratings, but I bought them (cheaply, otherwise I wouldn’t) because of the amount of dates (e.g. format, running times), as well as I bought (also cheaply) over the years 3 editions of the more reliable (imo) Maltin’s.

LH is long dead (or am I wrong?) and in the newer edition many ratings have been changed and truth is that especially the Leone films (but not DYS) have now much more favourable ratings (astonishingly without changing the not so favourable short critics!) and there are a few more SWs (Django; Return of Ringo) with at least 2 stars, but all in all it’s surely not a book to learn something about SWs, or other trashy genres.

I don’t know if this filmguide has really such a influence on what is appreciated by a wider audience as “classics”, but I for my part have never cared much about his “views”, and I think that most (all?) of the forum members also give a damn about LHs mainstream opinions.

Or what do you guys think about it?

A good analysis of a very poor film critic (Loser Halliwell).

I also have the 2003 edition of Halliwells Film/Video guide purely for reference on films.
You are correct Stanton that L.Halliwell died years ago but his partner John Walker is
now editing and taking overall credit for the Halliwell( trade mark) guides that come out.
It could be that Walker has slightly more sense & a tiny amount of better taste than LH.

The ratings Loser Halliwell gave were all heavily biased towards the most abysmal, dull
"comedies" and “talky dramas”. Most of these rotten turkeys got the Halliwell 3/4/5 stars
This is why I am so angry/upset/fighting because I see with Halliwell and other vile critics
all the greatest/classic films dismissed as 1 or 2 stars and the rotten comedy/dramas 4/5
Leonard Maltin is slightly better but he also is very biased against Westerns/Horror/Scifi.

Let us hope we can see an improvement and a greater fairness in critics/books/reviews.

I can honestly say that I have never read a review by Halliwell, and therefore can’t comment specifically on this. But I do find what people say about this interesting. I bought a book by Michael Parkinson (the professional Yorkshireman) and Clyde Jeavons called ‘A Pictorial History of Westerns’(1972) which talks (briefly) about the negative reaction to the sw and refers to the critique of the time which he describes as ‘… typifies the kind of cult-inspired wild and woolly writing which has occasionally been perpetrated on behalf of the Italian Western’ - but doesn’t unfortunately say where the critique originated. There is a quote that Parkinson uses that illustrates this … concerning the music that we all know and love.
He states - ’ This same critique reaches even headier heights (or lower depths, if you prefer) in a paragraph discussing the music scores composed for Italian Westerns, a much-discussed feature of the genre : “In spaghetti music, a hysterical shriek may occur in a fight sequence, or may accompany a rider dashing off into the sagebrush. Overall, this seemingly arbitrary music establishes the picture’s position in the universe” … then Parkinson sums it up marvellously about this critique with … ‘Perhaps not all hysterical shrieks are being confined to the screen …’

But even Parkinson then expresses his doubts, it would seem, about the value of ‘…a marked ‘Spaghetti’ influence’ on the 'American Western … for example in the terseness of films like Hang 'Em High and … the bludgeoningly gory killings of The Hunting Party… ’ and states ‘The feeling one has is that the strands of myth and honest re-creation which connect the American Western to the real American West are being snipped away by those whos roots are far removed from the actual frontier - and can only hope that the Kennedys, Peckinpahs, Boettichers and Hathaways will go on telling us how it really was … or at least how it might have been.’

Of course, Parkinson may feel slightly different about the negativity(?), or at least, concern, of the view he expresses given a possible perceived advantage (as was discussed earlier, on another thread) of hindsight. This was 1972 after all. The spaghetti western, has for many of us, become a more ‘real’ yet paradoxically more ‘cartoon’ west. The violence has become more stylised yet better reflects those times whereby - for instance - the family unit is not as safe as many ‘American’ westerns would have us believe. A woolly area for discussion indeed - and it’s still going on - Excellent!

[On a personal note to SD - I’m glad we’ve hopefully sorted all that other stuff out. My intention is usually not to deliberately offend, but I quite often stick my size 12s in clumsily. At least we know (some) of each others areas of sensitivity now. You have a far broader knowledge about film genres than I - sw in my only real passion regarding film. Giallos, Horror and sci-fi just fall in occasionally - but I might get to them one day (via ‘Nunsploitation’ :-*). We both love this genre (if not all of the films within it), and on that note - I raise a (non-alcoholic, this time only tho’) glass, and drink a toast to your good health! Cheers and seasons greetings! ;D]