Mystery of railway station Esperanza/Navajo Joe SOLVED!

Here is another map… Not sure if you seen this one but another to ponder over lol

I don´t like work, but since it is a rather free of will project I am not out yet :slight_smile:

No Hombre… I mean just when time look on the lower routes that was or around Colmenar… I do know and understand its time time time… Been on the case for years…

I have been Google-traveling near Colmenar Viejo and other lines around Madrid area today (and before) and found nothing interesting.
Also the last few days in the provinces of Murcia, Alicante and Valencia along both abandoned and current lines.

If ESPERANZA was located around Madrid, in Andalucia, Murcia or around Valencia I think I ought to have been unlucky not to have stumbled on the correct location and identified it as a strong candidate.

So its still a mystery.

The main scarce and therefore very important differentiating clues must be

  1. the special type of telegraph poles (have to be seen on old photographs from the 1960’s at or near the location) and
  2. the type of dark green smooth broad hills with lot of trees.
    Both these items are seldom seen i southern part of Spain in my experience.

The several abandonded lines “near” or north of Huelva can be seen at Google. It is amazing that such a line can be up to maybe around 50 kilometers and clearly be seen in spite of no existing railway. This is the case with the line from Zarza to Huelva.

Also northwest of Sevilla there are some lines.

I have “Google-travelled” along all or nearly all of them the last few days.
So far an ESPERANZA candidate has not been observed by me, but at least you CAN find several of the wished dark green smooth broad hills here and there in Andalucia, but no with an apropriate railway abandoned or not nearby. These hills tend to be positioned on an otherwise flatland.

Gracias por tu ayuda Amigo… Mi Hija esta terminando Universidad en Julio… Nosotros iremos al Hogar pensionista Guadix… Ja Ja.

Thanks runner… I think my next move is to go to The old peoples home in Guadix not Pinar… Just maybe someone could have been associated with Railways… Guadix being one of the main stations being home to the choo choo train. We leave not one stone unturned.Pedro

Good luck with that move, even if I feel it might be a longshot but sometimes they are necessary and actually hit :slight_smile:

It pops up more and more old station photos on the Ferrocarril Andalucia Facebook including from around 1966 but so far probably not the needle in the haystack, but if it do this needle wouldn´t hurt :wink:

HA HA. Good luck your end as well.

Just to emphasize that Piñar must be ruled out due to our “witness” it seems very clear that the current station house was located at the same place in 1966, and therefore ruling out this station. I must conclude that the probability for that is more close to 100 % than 99 % (mathematically not ruling out 99.6 % for example :slight_smile: )

4 months later I have just about “only” watched probably thousands of thousands of fotos from El Ferrocarril en Andalucía on Facebook when a new foto pops up from a collection of usually somewhere between maybe 20 to 100 fotos often watched before. That way you get a feeling for the possibilities of finding ESPERANZA in Andalucia. Very seldom the hunt gets hot though.

Around Córdoba-Jaén and the Subbética area with its abandoned railway the Estacion de Luque in a first glance at Google maps looks slightly interesting, but I can’t now judge from fotos if the old railway tracks and platform at the station around 1966 could match ESPERANZA well enough, and I just saw some fotos today from Luque station.

The landscapes seen from the low altitude of people at a station, as in the movie, look topographically not so bad, but nowadays there are TOO many olive trees plantations everywhere and the classic distant green hilly area seen from ESPERANZA station seemed to be covered by other more closely “wild” dark green trees or is that just my misinterpretation of the hilly green view ?

I have noticed that there are old fotos in that area where the telegraph poles were configurated close to those at Esperanza, but hardly or very seldom exactly the same 4 vertical x 2 horisontal configuration.
With current roads the time to travel from Guadix to Luque is around 1 h 40 minutes according to Google Maps but according to an actress some years ago she recalled it to have been within an hour or so away. That might be a vague evidence though.

This forum message is primarily ment to keep the hunt for ESPERANZA alive :wink:

Google Maps

They should make a movie about this thread.

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For the record I found out from The Facebook site that a 1990 movie was shot at the Luque station. There you get a tiny short glimpse of distance hills that seem darker than on Google Maps which is good, and there is an “edgy” elevated area on the correct higher terrain side but it doesn’t look as stony as in Navajo Joe, and in the background across the station there is a very high hill/mountain which I think should have been seen also in Navajo Joe.

In the Youtube movie you see 2 railway tracks with the correct configuration, and the curve can be seen at Google Maps. On some fotos from the Facebook site you see at least a third track also which I find a bit confusing.
Anyhow Luque seems slightly more interesting than some other “early” candidates for ESPERANZA but as the others most likely not good enough even if a visit to Luque might be fun especially to watch the distant hill view. The link to the video is at the interesting relevant part of the movie.

My wife and I made a 155 km trip and visited the Luque station in the Subbetica and we ran a work out along the abandonded track in a spectacular sunny environment.
As suspected Luque station cannot be the Esperanza location since the view of an imagined arriving train is not appropriate since a hill not that faraway wasn’t seen in the movie, even if the more distant hills seemed not so bad.

Otherwise much is promising with the curve of the tracks, a ridge opposite of the station with olive trees and adequate area where 2 old small buildings were seen in the movie, a little path crossing the railroad tracks and in one direction behind the station rather flat undulating areas but with maybe to much olive trees. The were some old poles but on the wrong side of the tracks and with wrong configuration of nodes but they might be newer than from the 1960’s.
Maybe the climate
of ESPERANZA and its vegetation implied a little bit colder area than the Subbetica ?
Luque%20stationsvy

Hi there All friends and Amigos…When i first started this topic on the mystery of ESPERANZA i thought we would have had it in the bag within months… Now nearly 9 years on we are still trying to solve where is the station used in the film.
We have spent hundreds and hundreds of hours like yourselves who have tried to solve this mystery. Although i have not been in communication on the forum for a while work has still been ongoing but to no reward… Thank you RUNNER for your input and mega time involved in trying to achieve a result. You beat us to it as we were planning a trip the weekend to Lugue station about hour and forty from us in Freila…Also thanks to MASSIMO I love the poster and made me laugh but true… When we originally went to PINAR STATION we were so excited thinking we cracked the code like several others who visited there…The backdrop where Burt Reynolds rides off up into the campo looks 99.9% exact fit but train coming into station we were blown out of the water. Someone somewhere must know the information but God knows who lol. If ever we get a result we need a fiesta between us all and make sure we go down in history as well as BURT lol.
I,m not that good at relaying information but as a photo reminder i will try… If it gets through to you all look at topic 03.MAY 2015 at 16-05pm.

Happy searching lol… Pedro Freila. Lots of photos from you guys as well way back in this topic also

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The 4th picture from your Foro Trenes post with the zoom view of the arriving train and distant green hills I think must be interpreted as olive tree region when you look close, so Luque wasn’t that bad in that respect.
But near the ESPERANZA station to the left it seems a bit more rigid area.

Well, the foto I posted here long ago which was a still from the movie which said Andalucia spring 1966 maybe should be taken as a ground for a hypothesis that it IS somewhere in Andalucia after all.

So there will probably be more reasons in the furure to make more trips around this area :slight_smile:
But I guess that Luque was the best candidate on the abandonded line now called The Vía Verde del Aceite.

RUNNER… Thanks for your reply and time… That photo of the train arriving into Esperanza is for sure olive country. We live in among it… But i guess i,ve run out of options but still believe its close to Guadix-Freila area. That image of train coming into Esperanza is exactly like the terrain/backdrop from the A92 road now in place 10 yrs ago… Blows the mind

I had not checked out Estacion Vado de Jaén thorough enough before the Luque trip, but it seems fair enough to do so on location for the record. The background hills are better than those at Luque but feel not 100 % or well enough.

On old foto from the 1950’s shows double tracks, and a newer shows single track with the background hills more visible but maybe too close and to small/low.

It would be interesting to study the terrain on the opposite of the station which do seems higher as wished, but there is no glimpse of the top of a green separate hill you could see in the movie (and at Piñar) when Joe rides away and that is a great obstacle if that scene in the movie was shot at ESPERANZA station location (as I recall you can see in the movie).
The movie shot from ESPEREANZA seems to imply that there might be a rather straight distant horisontal line maybe slightly tilted across the picture, which in theory could be that the railroad tracks after the curve to the left then bend to the right appearing as a line.
No signs of telegraph poles of interest.

Most likely not the answer to the ESPERANZA enigma, but nevertheless one of the many interesting candidates I think.

The fotos from Estacion Vado de Jaén :
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Google view
Google Maps

ESPERANZA
https://tinyurl.com/y5fbbjhn

There is foto from Zurgena with correct configuration 4 vertical pairs of 2 horisontal nodes from 1962 which are seen very seldom. Even if the configuration seems a bit odd with more narrow nodes at the upper part…
But that station and all other between Seron and Almendricos look bad and no good enough background green hills have I found.

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I just watched Navajo Joe for the first time in over a year without pausing the film for ESPERANZA railway station research.
So it says in the movie "Outdoor sequences filmed at Torremocha, Colmenar, Guadix and Almeria.

If that is true, and if the movie still from ESPERANZA station posted earlier in this thread which stated Andalucia spring 1966 also is true, then ESPERANZA station must be located in Almeria or Guadix according the laws of logic.

It is funny that the TOWN of ESPERANZA including nearby ranch in the movie was filmed at probably all locations Colmenar, Torremocha and MiniHollywood indicating that “everything is possible” regarding locations, despite logic maybe :slight_smile:

Hey Runner… I love that word logic lol. It covers a multitude of sins. ha ha… I keep going over old ground for years … This Mystery goes on and on… What is so strange is that in this day and age of the internet/extras in the film/carpenters/train drivers/railway workers/food suppliers to the cast/even the canteen worker on the coffee pot we have no input… Surely someone would have had an autograph/photo with one/some/or all of the cast/even production team…Pedro